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Effects of fasting on muscular physiology

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10 Jul 2009 16:10 #3783 by gmq
gmq created the topic: Effects of fasting on muscular physiology
Hello all! Quick insights needed. I'm a relatively young guy, but went through an extremely stressful few-year period (from which I have mostly recovered, still rebuilding with a potent diet, including a lot of wheatgrass juice) during which I was highly active in broad exercise to cope, exercise that left my muscular system/joints very beat up with toxic trigger points, calcified tissue, etc. etc. You name it. So I'm curious to know the role a lengthy fast can play in the detoxification and normalization of toxic/damaged/scartissue muscle. Being that the 80% of energy normally supplied to digestion will now be available to correction/detoxification, I'd think that the potential is there. I'm into some Taoist meditation, and know this will definitely add to the efficiency of the entire cleansing process as, which is far and away my primary interest. The disciplinary effects of a fasting/meditation (maybe outside in the sun? or in the woods with all of the Yin? we'll see!) combination would certainly be a bonus, though. Qi flows best in meditation, and in proper effective meditation you get three times the rest/recovery as you do in sleep, so that's promising as far as success on a fast is concerned. It is said that Pythagoras performed extended water fasts to purify body and mind for Olympic wrestling/etc., so I'm definitely curious to know of any of your experiences with fasting success in muscle/structural detox this way.

Also, do any of you have experience/knowledge of success with wheatgrass fasting? I'd imagine that it'd be an excellent combination, being that wheatgrass is so very potently cleansing and blood/qi-building.

Thanks everyone!

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11 Jul 2009 01:48 #3784 by gmq
gmq replied the topic: Re:Effects of fasting on muscular physiology
I understand that with water fasting you will lose muscle tone/mass, but will the muscles be cleansed and corrected of aaaall of the toxins that can accumulate from tendon to belly, and can scar tissue be corrected if there is a sufficient amino acid to do the job.

Would a wheatgrass fast of only enemas/implants and sufficient distilled water be as effective as I'm deducing? This would bypass the digestive, energy-exhausting digestive process completely, assuming a relatively clean colon for full absorption via the hemorrhoidal vein, albeit with a little colon cleansing that wheatgrass excels with....The phenomenal blood-building and detoxing of the wheatgrass along with its nutritional prowess to keep an even keel without wasting too much energy seems like a good fit for an otherwise lengthy and water-only fast.

Enlighten me Fast Doctor, and others!

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16 Jul 2009 01:25 #3789 by Slim Pickens
Slim Pickens replied the topic: Re:Effects of fasting on muscular physiology
Hi gmq, I am new to the forum as well

First, I dont formally meditate, drink wheat grass juice or do any messing around with my colon, so no experience to speak of there.

As per your muscle/joint issues, mine do not sound as severe as yours, but I did do some pretty good damage over the years to my back, hips, both knees, one elbow, one shoulder, one ankle, a couple of toes etc... you get the point, they span the scarred/muscle/joint/bone spectrum of injuries. Issues arose from some excessive weight training, contact sports, a couple of motorcycle accidents, some hard physical labour at a young age, the odd tussle among other things.

As relating to fasting, almost all of the above issues I was plagued with for 15+ years slowly either diminished or have been minimized once upon successive fasts. The same goes for any health issues I have had.

Nowadays, after a couple of 3 day fasts, a 7 day and a couple of 10 day fasts I feel much better at 34 than I did at 18. The fasts were over a span of 4 years and I am embarking on another one tomorrow.

Not sure if that helps with your post or not. I dont dismiss wheatgrass or meditation, I have read about both but not delved into either. Wheatgrass juice only is not what I would consider a fast as your body is getting all requirements from the wheatgrass instead of seeking within, rather it is an excellent surface cleanse.

Hope this helps a little.

Slim

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16 Jul 2009 17:50 #3791 by david
david replied the topic: Re:Effects of fasting on muscular physiology
gmq Slim Pickens is right. Green juice or wheatgrass juice is not strictly speaking a fast, but what some would call a juice diet or a juice feast. However in my opinion, any chlorophyll based juice is worth a lot more than a whole range of different fruit and veg juices.(not least because the chemical composition of wheatgrass is very similar to that of the blood) But this is only my view. I also believe that it would be more cleansing to both the gut and in terms of its power to detoxify the system. It may also be a very good way to prepare for a true fast with the added benefit of being able to maintain a normal work schedule for a longer period than if you were on water only.

As for meditation, there are no doubt many members on this site who meditate and combine meditation with fasting, and again my personal opinion is that any method which quietens down the mind from excessive thinking can only be beneficial. And when the brain is stilled then the body will expend less energy supplying the brain and channel more of it to healing and detoxing.

Thanks for the post

David

Great minds discuss ideas;
Average minds discuss events;
Small minds discuss people.

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16 Jul 2009 21:22 #3792 by gmq
gmq replied the topic: Re:Effects of fasting on muscular physiology
Thanks for the response guys. I'm in line with most of what you're saying also. Lets just say wheatgrass has treated me with the very utmost respect! I'm going to continue to build up with it, being that I was and still am deficient, albeit to a lesser degree. The time will come when I've rebuilt enough that I'm ready to start working towards progress with water-only fasts. Sky's the limit, it seems!

As for the effects of a water-only fast on muscle condition, do you guys find that fasts make you looser and more flexible, which would imply muscle detoxing and rebuilding/correcting in areas of overuse/tension/damage?

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17 Jul 2009 04:19 #3793 by Slim Pickens
Slim Pickens replied the topic: Re:Effects of fasting on muscular physiology
Hey gmq, just throwing this out there, still not quite providing the answers I think you wanna hear, but some muscular density changed significantly for me since I have been incorporating fasts.

My typical weight was around 205 - 215 pds since I was 18. My build was moderate to athletic. My muscles and overall body structure was bigger than it is now. Nowadays, I have much leaner stronger dense muscle tissue throughout my body. Workouts are much more efficient with this new leaner muscle, my head is clearer and I get very tight, high quality and focused workouts and recovery is a breeze even after the most intense workouts. As to damage repaired, my left shoulder probably got it the worst of all. First I absolutely planted it super hard at very high speed into the packed snow while snowboarding. It was absolutely destroyed, felt like it hit concrete. Then a few months later when it was somewhat recovered, I figured I was good to go for contact ice hockey, again killed it but kept playing for some unknown reason. To fast forward things after years of pain it slowly diminished into a non issue for me through fasting and smart effective workouts.

Does this help at all?

Sounds like you may have had a setback both spiritually and physically. as mentioned, I am new here, but this site to me is a great place with a wealth of knowledge to offer to get your recovery on track.

All the best,
Slim

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18 Jul 2009 22:28 #3797 by TheFastDoctor
TheFastDoctor replied the topic: Re:Effects of fasting on muscular physiology
Hi gmq, you have received some REAL sound advice from Slim Pickens and David.

I know I bore many people with repetition but please continue bearing in mind: Detox consists of
1. MOBILIZATION of toxins (Fasting) and
2. ELMINATION.
It's no use mobilizing your toxins into circulation and then leaving them there to do damage.. that's where the (5-step) elimination cycles developed from.

And remember, there's nothing you can put INTO you that can take anything OUT.. except perhaps a non-absorbable substance that would flush the gut. Even so, we seldom need those: The body has been wonderfully created to do its own thing. Just give it a gap.

André

All my posts are "generic", based on my opinions and experiences only and are not intended to replace the advice of your own licensed medical practitioner.

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13 Jul 2011 19:50 #8377 by Milena
Milena replied the topic: Re: Effects of fasting on muscular physiology
Just came across this information on Dr. Mercola's website. This is an incerpt from an article by Ori Hofmekler ( articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/arch...y-ori-hofmekler.aspx )

"Exercising While Fasting

Probably the most intense way to improve your hunger durability is by exercising while fasting. This presents a double challenge to your body and it yields a stronger signal to adapt than fasting or exercise alone. Though exercise while fasting may initially affect your maximum performance, it will nevertheless come with an additional bonus.

A study published in the Journal of Physchology/November 2010 indicated that exercising while fasting increases the body's metabolic adaptation efficiency to utilize energy, burn fat and deposit protein in the muscle – substantially more than when exercising after a meal. The researchers reported that the increased capacity to deposit protein in the muscle as observed in people who were exercising while fasting and then eating a post-exercise meal, is a result of increased insulin sensitivity and activation of the muscle mTOR (the mechanism that increases muscle protein synthesis).

Your body is inherently programmed to benefit from acute hunger (via periodic fasting or undereating) and even more so when exercising while fasting. This probably has to do with an early adaptation mechanism to hunger and hardship which evolved to support human survival during primordial times of food scarcity and intense hardship. Apparently, this primal evolutionary trait is still pertinent today and it potentially affects your physical shape."

May the Energy you free from digesting serves your Body and Spirit well!

All my posts are based on my opinions and experiences only and are not intended to replace the advice of the licensed medical practitioner.
The following user(s) said Thank You: Eurico

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13 Jul 2011 20:51 #8380 by cory
cory replied the topic: Re: Effects of fasting on muscular physiology
This is an old topic you found. I read the article on the website you linked to written by a body builder never heard of satiety hormones before.

I guess that is why I don't really feel hungry much anymore as I been exercising while fasting for over half a year now.

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14 Jul 2011 00:26 - 14 Jul 2011 00:27 #8383 by borota
borota replied the topic: Re: Effects of fasting on muscular physiology
If I am active while fasting, my craving for food is pretty much not there... Also I feel as energetic and almost as "well" as while eating. In some aspects even better if I am to take into account the almost addictive, euphoric feeling that I get after the first 3 days.

But when I wake up in the morning, after the night's rest, I feel awful, and can't wait to take my brisk morning walk or some other physical activity to become "normal" again.

This has been my experience up to now (5th day). Also with previous fasts.

Now I've read some opinions that if you are active, you don't get as much detox as if resting. Not sure, it might be true, but if I only rest, I end up stopping my fast very early (3 days at most) because I feel so awful that I simply can't take it any-longer.

I fault some of the books I've read which all recommended almost complete resting for the fact that I haven't been able to carry on with a fast for more than 3 days for the last couple of years. Doctor Fast's book, Health Won + various posts I've read here brought me back on the right path. :- )

I am pretty early in my fast still, but it looks like I need to find a meaningful balance between resting (which I also do) and also being active (which I am for most of the day). Resting is also a very important part of the fast, it seems, but if only resting, it gets pretty much unbearable. One just has to start moving/sweating or pretty much give up the fast.

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14 Jul 2011 00:43 #8384 by Milena
Milena replied the topic: Re: Effects of fasting on muscular physiology

borota wrote: Now I've read some opinions that if you are active, you don't get as much detox as if resting. Not sure, it might be true, but if I only rest, I end up stopping my fast very early (3 days at most) because I feel so awful that I simply can't take it any-longer.

I fault some of the books I've read which all recommended almost complete resting for the fact that I haven't been able to carry on with a fast for more than 3 days for the last couple of years. Doctor Fast's book, Health Won + various posts I've read here brought me back on the right path. :- )

I am pretty early in my fast still, but it looks like I need to find a meaningful balance between resting (which I also do) and also being active (which I am for most of the day). Resting is also a very important part of the fast, it seems, but if only resting, it gets pretty much unbearable. One just has to start moving/sweating or pretty much give up the fast.


I do not see any logic in why being active would minimize detoxification process. Yes, during the long dry fasts it is not recommended to perform any aerobically demending activities, but that is only because the blood gets much thicker and such activities with elevated heart rate could lead to a stroke. Otherwise, both Dr. Filonov and Shennikov promote daily walking.

Ultimately if you listen to your body you will be fine. If it wants to rest, you rest, if it wants to be active, you become active. I personally feel greater need for sleep when I do my 36-hour dry fasts and absolutely do not go against it if that's what my body wants.

During my 40-day fast there were times when I would be itching for being more active and I would find ways to accomplish that.

May the Energy you free from digesting serves your Body and Spirit well!

All my posts are based on my opinions and experiences only and are not intended to replace the advice of the licensed medical practitioner.

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29 Aug 2012 13:55 - 29 Aug 2012 14:39 #12138 by Shant
Shant replied the topic: Re: Effects of fasting on muscular physiology

borota wrote: If I am active while fasting, my craving for food is pretty much not there... Also I feel as energetic and almost as "well" as while eating. In some aspects even better if I am to take into account the almost addictive, euphoric feeling that I get after the first 3 days.

But when I wake up in the morning, after the night's rest, I feel awful, and can't wait to take my brisk morning walk or some other physical activity to become "normal" again.

This has been my experience up to now (5th day). Also with previous fasts.


I could second this one. And I think it has to do with testosterone release because I used to work out at 9 am onwards daily.

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