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Acid Toxins released during Fasting

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02 Dec 2009 02:57 #4172 by Jordan
Jordan created the topic: Acid Toxins released during Fasting
Hello Fasting Doctor,

Please tell me if in your research you have found any data on acid toxins being released during fasting - these would be acid toxins generally found in the cellular membrane. I would assume there would be an increase of acid toxins released from diseased complex organisms (during fasting) that would have had 'prior to fasting' very low pH cellular levels (acidosis range) of say 4-5 pH with obvious weaker template energy (DNA end-caps). I have noted that pH does increase after long fasting which should in theory release the acid toxins into the blood for eventual ejection. I have also noted that in ending the fast the recovery period(anabolism) is improved with high mineral / vitamin content vegetables/fruits - seemingly the minerals help to neutralize remaining acidic toxins that the fasting released - so one should not eat meat when ending a fast as all meat lowers cellular pH greatly, risking a sudden case of acidosis (and massive free radicals with limited anti-oxidants) as any toxins not yet released could be re-absorbed with the sudden pH drop
Cheers,
Jordan O'Hara

Jordan OHara, PSP

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02 Dec 2009 23:39 #4180 by TheFastDoctor
TheFastDoctor replied the topic: Re:Acid Toxins released during Fasting
Thanks for the intellectually stimulating posts, Jordan! It's always a pleasure reading your input.

Overall, I must be honest, I have never given much credit to the "acid/alkaline" theory about food and lifestyle.

Let's just first reflect on "Acid": This is a term often misunderstood and abused, likely because people tend to have a negative connotation with the word.

* As you refer to DNA: Remember this is an acid (Deoxyribonucleic acid).
* Most vitamins are acids. (Ascorbic acid, pantothenic acid, etc.)
* Proteins are acids.

Actually, our bodies, with the exception of the extra-cellular component of bone, is constructed of acids. Whilst it is true that the blood serum is slightly alkaline (pH about 7.4) the inside of cells are naturally less alkaline (pH 7.0-7.4) and in the cellular organelles such as Mitochondria it is typically acidic (pH under 6.9).

There are many liquid components/compartments in the body, so it is not possible to say your body has a specific pH.

Due to the (chemical/enzymatic) processing of nutrients in our digestive systems, there is no universal correlation between the measurable pH of a food and its effect on any of the body's compartments' adicity or alkalinity. Bear in mind all foods pass through the stomach, where it is exposed to Hydrochloric acid and pH as low as 2 at times. In bile, on the other hand, it can be as high as 9. Actually, every single cell in the body has a (slightly) different pH or acidity level.

Thus before I can comment meaningfully to these issues, I need to know how for example the "very low pH cellular levels" are measured, as I have never come across a pH meter that can sample living intracellular fluid.

Looking forward to some meaningful exchange of insights.

André

All my posts are "generic", based on my opinions and experiences only and are not intended to replace the advice of your own licensed medical practitioner.

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16 Jan 2010 17:49 #4271 by lorree
lorree replied the topic: Re:Acid Toxins released during Fasting
Hello!

I have read on a fast to drink many liters a day to combat the acid and toxins being poured out into the system, then I read the article on "how to fast" and it says only drink one liter a day in small sips. Can someone assist with this, as I am going to start intermixing water fasting into my juicing (won't call it juice fasting!)

Thanks,
Lorree

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18 Jan 2010 02:16 #4273 by Meditating
Meditating replied the topic: Re:Acid Toxins released during Fasting
Everyone is different so their water needs are certainly different. Since so many of us have an impaired thirst mechanism, especially when we get older, you want to make sure you have an adequate water intake.

As for my personal opinion. I am not sure what difference it makes if you didn't drink your water in small sips throughout the day, unless you are trying to ensure your stomach shrinks drastically. While at work, most days I will drink 2 - 16 oz. servings of herbal tea throughout the day. But if I leave my tea at home and I realize I am thirsty, I will drink 12-20 ounces of water at a time and do just fine. I don't feel any differently.

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18 Jan 2010 06:43 #4274 by TheFastDoctor
TheFastDoctor replied the topic: Re:Acid Toxins released during Fasting
As always, your posts make so much sense, Meditating! Only wish I had a clue how much an ounce is.

We are quite different. After a few years of fasting at least 30-60 hours weekly, I noted the need for water diminishing and for the past 25 odd years my fasts have been primarily "dry".. at least for the first 3 days. A colleague of mine from Siberia once experimented with a 12 day "air only" fast and found no harm done to the body.

BUT these dry fasts are really just for those who have detoxified themselves repeatedly over several years and continue to do so. If you have low levels of toxins in the body, you don't need a lot of water to carry it out. And if you metabolize your fats well, you do produce a meaningful volume of "metabolic water".

One of the big problems is of course salt. Sodium Chloride needs a lot of water to eliminate, and the typical Western diet contains between 10 and 20 times the volume of salt we really need. I never buy salt and never add salt to food. This also reduces the volume of water needed.

Generally the appropriate advice is to regularly take a sip of water or at least "smell" some water to help your biofeedback decide if you need some, then have as much as you feel like. Pure water will never interfere with the fasting metabolic processes unless you really over-indulge.

André

All my posts are "generic", based on my opinions and experiences only and are not intended to replace the advice of your own licensed medical practitioner.

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18 Jan 2010 07:40 #4276 by Meditating
Meditating replied the topic: Re:Acid Toxins released during Fasting
App. 33.5 oz. equal a liter.

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05 Feb 2010 18:32 #4365 by Jordan
Jordan replied the topic: Re:Acid Toxins released during Fasting
Hello,

I've finished completing some studies now with acid / alkaline - pH levels and the effects on life. Basically there is a marketing side to this information that distorts the truth on this science...but I won't get into that. The recorded acid / alkaline of water or food ingested really have little notable direct effect during metabolism. What I have found is that it is the full spectrum salt-mineral balance available within the complex organism that effects the pH levels within all living cells. So food or water sources with tons of minerals in the proper proportion will assist the body in keeping it's own proper pH levels at all times. If the body is not provided with the proper supply of a full spectrum of minerals it must try and compensate by leaching from any possible stored sources & this causes fluctuations of the correct pH levels in the cells - that in turn causes much cellular damage. The body truly is a very advanced bio electric organism. My studies will continue in this direction as it is fascinating. I use plant life for all my research (no animals except me) - although plants are not as complex as us they provide excellent and very fast data results when testing on different mineral / light combination's etc. For example I have tested some very expensive single mineral supplements that caused extreme deformations on the growth. However when I provided my plants with over 80 pure unprocessed minerals and no industrial fertilizer they flourished and continue to do so. I now take over 80 pure unprocessed minerals in a brine solution I make. I'll be doing a long water fast while ingesting a teaspoon of salt-mineral brine daily and my nano-silver purified water. I'll report if I notice anything different with this water fast compared to my many previous 15 day water fasts.
Cheers,

Jordan OHara, PSP

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05 Feb 2010 18:50 #4366 by TheFastDoctor
TheFastDoctor replied the topic: Re:Acid Toxins released during Fasting
Thanks for a fascinating post. Is it at all possible to list somewhere these 80 minerals? If one bears in mind that there are only about 100 elements in nature, many of which are toxic, even in low dosages... it would be interesting to see where all these fit in.

Do bear in mind also that the plant root is the interface between the inorganic and organic world: All organic life is most principally made in Chlorophyll, using inorganic substances (including carbon dioxide) and sunlight to produce the most basic hydrocarbons which it then further process into complex carbohydrates, some of which are turned into (amino) acids to start along the line of making proteins. Of course the plant cell, which has a cell wall and not only cell membranes like us animals, do indeed react very differently.

It would be really interesting to see if you could measure pH of the various fluids involved in your experiments.

Please keep us posted on your fascinating research!

André

All my posts are "generic", based on my opinions and experiences only and are not intended to replace the advice of your own licensed medical practitioner.

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05 Feb 2010 18:57 #4367 by Meditating
Meditating replied the topic: Re:Acid Toxins released during Fasting
Jordan, thanks for the update.

Basically there is a marketing side to this information that distorts the truth on this science


While I don't doubt proper science, the bias and what often appears to be intentional manipulation of "scientific" studies leads me to believe I can't believe in science at all anymore as it is more than likely tainted. Although I have felt this way for a few years, several months ago I listened to this show on NPR about busted corrupt medical studies and how the FDA really knew about it and it just made me sick. So much seems to be predicated on a scam these days.

I find your work very interesting because, while I believe I have reached a consensus in my own head as to what I should eat, I still struggle with my water intake. Despite the conventional argument regarding our ability to absorb and metabolize organic vs. inorganic minerals, I still come back to the fact that minerals are in the water naturally and nature knows more about my health than anyone else.

Is there any info on the web you would point me to for the purposes of thinking about this dilemma? I currently use RO water that I have re-mineralized with mineral drops by Trace Minerals, which is a concentrate pulled from the US Great Lakes with the sodium level lowered. This is my best guess so far and with my hypertension, I can't handle the sodium. Just a little sets me off.

I know you don't want to go into the marketing bias, but I would be interested in knowing which way you think it leans if you don't mind - acid or alkaline.

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05 Feb 2010 21:17 #4369 by TheFastDoctor
TheFastDoctor replied the topic: Re:Acid Toxins released during Fasting
You're quite right as always, Meditating.. this is a difficult subject. In Medical circles the old notion about "your 8 glasses of water a day" is fast becoming discredited. We have thirst sensors to guide us, after all.

It still bothers me that people focus so much on the few nanograms of minerals in the WATER they drink, and not the thousands or millions of times more of the SAME minerals in the FOOD they eat. It just does not make sense to focus on the place where there's the least.. after all, once inside your body, all minerals distribute in the water components of your body.. whether they entered through the skin, through the lungs, through the mucous membranes of the mouth or through the digestive tract.

By the mechanism of osmosis, the minerals soon distribute to every part of your body. NO difference if they were bound to organic molecules when you swallowed them.. the hydrochloric acid in the stomach ionizes them anyway. So whether you ate a bit of limestone or drank water that percolated through the limestone, or eat a fruit that grew in soil formed from limestone, within minutes in your body it's the same thing.

I do market a mineral water in South Africa.. saturated with dolomite. And having analyzed the blood levels of about 6000 patients I did find it helped balance a few minerals.. or did it? Perhaps the exercise, perhaps the frame of mind, what other influences played a role?

Be careful not to let theoretical arguments become a self fulfilling prophecy in your body!

André

All my posts are "generic", based on my opinions and experiences only and are not intended to replace the advice of your own licensed medical practitioner.

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06 Feb 2010 04:38 #4374 by Jordan
Jordan replied the topic: Re:Acid Toxins released during Fasting
Here are the minerals I use daily when eating and when fasting.

Analysis: Concentration (in ppm or specifically indicated)

* Actinium <0.001
* Aluminum 18.0
* Ammonium 0.010
* Antimony <0.01
* Arsenic <0.001
* Astatine <0.001
* Barium <0.05
* Beryllium <0.01
* Bismuth <0.10
* Boron 13.2
* Bromine 2.1
* Bromine 2.1
* Cadmium <0.01
* Calcium 792
* Cerium <0.001
* Cesium <0.001
* Chloride 585 g/kg
* Chromium 0.16
* Colbalt 0.60
* Copper 0.06
* Dysprosium <4.0
* Erbium <0.001
* Europium <3.0
* Fluoride 16.0
* Francium <1.0
* Gadolinium <0.001
* Gallium <0.001
* Germanium <0.001
* Gold <1.0
* Hafnium <0.001
* Holmium <0.001
* Hydrogencarbonate <1.0g/kg
* Indium <0.001
* Iodine <0.1g/kg
* Iridium <2.0
* Iron 1.96
* Lanthanum <0.001
* Lead <0.01
* Lithium 0.22
* Lutetium <0.001
* Magnesium 255
* Manganese 0.27
* Mercury <0.01
* Molybdenum 0.01
* Neodymium <0.001
* Neptunium <0.001
* Nickel 0.01
* Niobium <0.001
* Nitrate 0.09
* Osmium <0.001
* Palladium <0.001
* Phosphorus 3.50
* Platinum 0.47
* Plutonium <0.001
* Polonium <0.001
* Potassium 9330
* Praseodymium <0.001
* Protactinium <0.001
* Radium <0.001
* Rhenium <2.5
* Rhodium <0.001
* Rubidium 0.04
* Ruthenium <0.001
* Samarium <0.001
* Scandium <0.0001
* Selenium 0.05
* Silicon 23.0
* Silver 0.031
* Sodium 410 g/kg
* Strontium 4.73
* Tantalum 1.10
* Tellurium <0.001
* Terbium <0.001
* Thallium 0.06
* Thorium <0.001
* Thulium <0.001
* Tin <0.01
* Titanium <0.001
* Uranium <0.001
* Vanadium 0.06
* Water Content 6.2 g/kg
* Wolfram <0.001
* Ytterbium <0.001
* Zinc 2.38
* Zirconium 0.001

Jordan OHara, PSP

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06 Feb 2010 09:19 #4380 by TheFastDoctor
TheFastDoctor replied the topic: Re:Acid Toxins released during Fasting
Please indulge me making a few comments:

* Actinium <0.001
* Aluminum 18.0
Remember the days when Aliminium utensils were banned? They were thought to contribute to Alzheimer's disease.
* Ammonium 0.010
Ammonium is not a mineral, it's a chemical made up of Nitrogen and Hydrogen.
* Antimony <0.01
* Arsenic <0.001
* Astatine <0.001
Astatine is Radio-active. So of course in time it would decay and its concentration would be lower than given on the package.
* Barium <0.05
* Beryllium <0.01
* Bismuth <0.10
* Boron 13.2
* Bromine 2.1
* Bromine 2.1
* Cadmium <0.01
* Calcium 792
* Cerium <0.001
* Cesium <0.001
Some Cesium isotopes are of course also radio-active and this metal is actually liquid at body temperature but it can explode when coming in contact with water. Cesium isotopes are often used for radiotherapy in the treatment of cancers.
* Chloride 585 g/kg
* Chromium 0.16
* Colbalt 0.60
* Copper 0.06
Copper has been associated with impotence; we do need it in very small amounts but some people (with Wilson's disease, a genetic condition) gets brain damage from it.
* Dysprosium <4.0
Dysprosium is mildly toxic if soluble. It never occurs on its own in Nature.
* Erbium <0.001
* Europium <3.0
* Fluoride 16.0
* Francium <1.0
* Gadolinium <0.001
* Gallium <0.001
* Germanium <0.001
* Gold <1.0
Gold is of course extremely toxic to humans, and we use it to destroy actively dividing cells in serious diseases such as Rheumatoid arthritis.
* Hafnium <0.001
* Holmium <0.001
* Hydrogencarbonate <1.0g/kg
Also called Bicarbonate. This is made up of the elements Hydroge, Oxygen and Carbon. The body makes huge volumes of these during metabolism.
* Indium <0.001
* Iodine <0.1g/kg
* Iridium <2.0
* Iron 1.96
* Lanthanum <0.001
* Lead <0.01
I cannot believe anyone would willingly take lead.. it is, after all, toxic.
* Lithium 0.22
* Lutetium <0.001
* Magnesium 255
* Manganese 0.27
* Mercury <0.01
Mercury is of course also toxic, that's why mercury thermometers have been banned.
* Molybdenum 0.01
* Neodymium <0.001
* Neptunium <0.001
* Nickel 0.01
* Niobium <0.001
* Nitrate 0.09
Nitrate is not a mineral but part of an inorganic salt, containing nitrogen and oxygen.
* Osmium <0.001
* Palladium <0.001
* Phosphorus 3.50
* Platinum 0.47
* Plutonium <0.001
Plutonium is likely the most toxic mineral on earth.. and does not occur in Nature. It is made from uranium in nuclear reactors and of course remain radio-active.
* Polonium <0.001
* Potassium 9330
* Praseodymium <0.001
* Protactinium <0.001
* Radium <0.001
The name radium is derived from the fact that it is radio-active.
* Rhenium <2.5
* Rhodium <0.001
* Rubidium 0.04
* Ruthenium <0.001
* Samarium <0.001
* Scandium <0.0001
* Selenium 0.05
* Silicon 23.0
Silicon is what a large part of sand (and glass) are made up from.
* Silver 0.031
* Sodium 410 g/kg
* Strontium 4.73
* Tantalum 1.10
* Tellurium <0.001
* Terbium <0.001
* Thallium 0.06
* Thorium <0.001
* Thulium <0.001
Thallium is very toxic. It is used in some rat poisons.
* Tin <0.01
* Titanium <0.001
* Uranium <0.001
* Vanadium 0.06
* Water Content 6.2 g/kg
* Wolfram <0.001
* Ytterbium <0.001
* Zinc 2.38
* Zirconium 0.001[/quote]

Thanks for the list, Jordan. I can assure you, I will not swallow this.

André

All my posts are "generic", based on my opinions and experiences only and are not intended to replace the advice of your own licensed medical practitioner.

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06 Feb 2010 16:06 #4382 by Jordan
Jordan replied the topic: Re:Acid Toxins released during Fasting
I'll try give you a different perspective. All life on Earth evolved in the presence of all the minerals, so why do we not need them all today? Why is it OK to get today's common minerals (some are the most radioactive) from deficient and pouted sources?
This mineral salt is mined from the Himalayan mountains and comes from the Primal Sea - it is estimated to be 1.5 Million year old perfect mineral salt. We use all minerals for some purpose - but science is only just learning about them. If you isolate any mineral you can easily make it poisonous when used in large unnatural volumes. Some scientist often are too quick to assume something is poisonous just because overdosing on it can make it appear so. I see you are concerned about radio-activity...please note: Our soil, in which our food stuff is grown, contains many radioactive elements such as POTASSIUM (K), most people ingest about 2.5 g per day of K daily. Potassium decay emits a beta ray with maximum energy of 1.33 Mev. which is not that much lower then getting an X-ray from at the Hospital & you get it 24/7. Potassium also emits Very Dangerous Gamma radiation, Gamma rays from potassium each have an energy of 1460 thousand electron volts (keV). Most people don't like to talk about how radioactive our food is. Potassium as we know is in very close contact with our DNA - these radiations split your DNA in half no problem all the time. Just one example of why we need all the minerals is this as they keep each-other in check: Most people have tons of Potassium and tons of Iron right? But our food stuffs contain almost no Rubidium (R), Rubidium working in partnership with Selenium acts as a Gatekeeper on Iron preventing Iron overload of the blood which 99.9% of people past 50 often suffer from. Selenium allows the Iron in only when it is needed. Rubidium acts similar to Potassium in the cell and evicts a percentage of Potassium out from the cell lowering Gama Ray damage to the DNA and providing many other benefits...how many health scientist are educated on Rubidium? - Not many but yet it is critical to healthy life. All the minerals are needed, some only in very small amounts and as the list shows the ppm.

Jordan OHara, PSP

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06 Feb 2010 16:24 #4383 by Jordan
Jordan replied the topic: Re:Acid Toxins released during Fasting

* Lead <0.01
I cannot believe anyone would willingly take lead.. it is, after all, toxic.

Lead salts at very low levels produce nitric oxide, which boosts the immune system to fight off bacteria.
Research by CNRS www.cnrs.fr/index.php and study published in the Journal of Analytical Chemistry: pubs.acs.org/journal/ancham


Jordan OHara, PSP

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06 Feb 2010 23:01 #4387 by TheFastDoctor
TheFastDoctor replied the topic: Re:Acid Toxins released during Fasting
I have huge respect for your stance, dear Jordan, but still disagree with several of the arguemnts.

Our recent evolutionary ancestors did not eat soil or isolated minerals even if it was 1.5 million years old. Worms do, yes, but their intestines are designed to filter nutrients from soil, in a very different way ours work.

Our natural diet consists of plants, which have been created to filter out on their root system these poisonous minerals from the soil, protecting us from their detrimental effects.

Of course there are radio-active Potassium isotopes. But the typical fertilizer (and natural potassium) used in agriculture contains very few if any of these isotopes.. after all, they decay over time. So after 1.5 million years.. the radio-active decay is long past.

Some children have been observed eating soil.. and was found to be iron deficient, likely from the parasite eggs in the very soil their instinct told them to get the iron from.

I will still not bypass the plant root filter and will not allow this kind of substance to make intimate contact with my body.

André

All my posts are "generic", based on my opinions and experiences only and are not intended to replace the advice of your own licensed medical practitioner.

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