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vomiting on the last fast why ?

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07 Sep 2014 22:26 #23216 by pierrot
pierrot created the topic: vomiting on the last fast why ?
Hi@All.

I'm planning a new fast for this month, the last time I tried one, I started feeling bloated on my stomach since the 16th day of fast.
Like something was blocked or locked on my stomach, my stomach was like full of water, like water can't goes down !
This bloated sensation became a nausea sensation lasting for 4 or 5 days and I finally started vomiting on drinking water, so I stopped the fast.


That was not my first fast, it was my second, but on the first fast I didn't have a problem like this, I did a first fast which was maybe 26-28 day long which I stopped just by greedy desire to eat again instead the second which was something like 19-22 days long which I stopped because of vomiting.

What happened in the second fast Doctor ?
I could I prevent it ?
What should I do if it happens again?

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08 Sep 2014 05:55 #23219 by TheFastDoctor
TheFastDoctor replied the topic: vomiting on the last fast why ?
It seems, dear Pierrot, as if your body "delved deeper" into its reserves during the second fast. These older reserves contains more old accumulated toxins, which were likely responsible for your symptoms.

You could prevent it by doing regular, vigorous elimination cycles during the fast. And by doing a weekly 2-3 day fast giving your elimination systems a regular opportunity to eliminate these toxins before their concentration is too high.

i suggest a weekly fast of about 3 days, plus intensive elimination cycles. And perhaps once a year a flush of the gut with a Macrogol solution (Which I have explained many times on these forums).

Hope this helps.

André

All my posts are "generic", based on my opinions and experiences only and are not intended to replace the advice of your own licensed medical practitioner.

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08 Sep 2014 16:45 #23235 by pierrot
pierrot replied the topic: vomiting on the last fast why ?

Many thanks for your reply your reply is helping me much but I would like to emit an objection to your "delved deeper" theory.
I should be wrong of course, but please I would like more explanation on your toxin stack theory, because I reckon that according to my first fast that I delved deeper than the second one.

1st fast : 85 Kg -> 63 Kg
The fact is on my first fast I began with something like 85 kilos and ended at 63 kilos.

2nd fast : 87 kilos -> 72 kilos
The second fast where I encountered my nausea problem, I started at maybe 85 kilos too and started feeling nausea maybe at 75 kilos.


If it would have delve deeper why I encountered problems being down of only 10-12 kilos on my second fast although I've dropped more than 20 kilos on the first without a problem ?


I'm now planning another long fast, because I've upped in weight to 90 kilos, since I seriously sprained my ankle (one month and half of crutch), and I still could not making sport since from I developed CPRS and stills now.

What is your thinking about CPRS ?

How and when should I take macrogol solution during long fast ?

Best regards,

Pierrot.

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08 Sep 2014 22:29 #23239 by TheFastDoctor
TheFastDoctor replied the topic: vomiting on the last fast why ?
Thank you dear Pierrot for an intellectually stimulating argument. My experience has been that "last in, first out" holds for toxins to at least some extent. This was easier to "measure" or observe where specific toxins were involved, specifically penicillin (which can be smelled easily on elimination) and LSD (which led in some cases to real "trips"). It may thus be that during your subsequent fasts you "encountered" more resilient (older) toxins earlier, causing a resistance to breaking down fat. Older fat is more stable and thus more resistant to re-conversion to energy.

CPRS?

Macrogol is NOT essential, but we recommend it for people with impaction problems or those going on longer fasts who want to be sure that the gut is empty upon entering ketosis. This is a very individual decision preferably based on the clinical situation.

Looking forward to your contributions to these forums.

André

All my posts are "generic", based on my opinions and experiences only and are not intended to replace the advice of your own licensed medical practitioner.

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09 Sep 2014 08:03 #23241 by pierrot
pierrot replied the topic: vomiting on the last fast why ?
Many thanks for your reply. I just though I've unstacked less old toxins on my second fast because I dropped down less fat and weight than the first time and so I was thinking that I dug less than the first.
I though that beginning the second fast, my weight was 87 kilos and if I would like to dig older toxins than the first fast I would have to overpass the 63 kilos mark, isn't ?

You said on your last post that I may have fat resistance on my second fast but the fact is that I was still losing fat as equal as my first fast.
I remember it was something like 600grams/day.


Do you have a thread talking about macrogol protocol during fast?


Crps :
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Complex_regional_pain_syndrome

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09 Sep 2014 08:08 #23242 by TheFastDoctor
TheFastDoctor replied the topic: vomiting on the last fast why ?
The ONLY way you can lose less weight, dear Pierrot, is if you burn exclusively fat (35 kJ/gram) instead of protein or carbohydrate (17 kJ/gram). The slower you lose weight during a fast the more assured you are that it is fat you lose.

Since your kidneys filter water soluble toxins all the time, only fat soluble toxins tend to accumulate in the body. Thus indeed you "delve deeper" on subsequent fasts and unleash older toxins.. To at least some extent at least. Things are never so perfectly clear cut!

You can search these forums for Macrogol, Poly-ethylene Glycol or Klean-Prep, we discussed it several times.

Best Wishes

André

All my posts are "generic", based on my opinions and experiences only and are not intended to replace the advice of your own licensed medical practitioner.

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09 Sep 2014 12:51 #23244 by rothery
rothery replied the topic: vomiting on the last fast why ?
Dear Pierrot, here is a thread I started on the topic of Macrogol. Hope this helps.
www.fastingconnection.com/forum/Posts-fo...lternatives-to-enema

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09 Sep 2014 17:48 #23247 by pierrot
pierrot replied the topic: vomiting on the last fast why ?
I'm just back from the pharmacist, here is the problem.
    macrogol is supplied withan orange-grapefruit taste, so it is not recommended during fast isn'it ?
    and have some additives E220 and E240, is it ok to take this during water fast ?

    Movicol contains
  • macrogol 3350
  • baking soda
  • potassium chloride
  • sodium chloride
  • is it ok to take that during water fast ?

    Klean-prep is :
  • macrogol 3350
  • sodium sulfate
  • baking soda
  • sodium chloride
  • potassium chloride
  • and have to be taken with another thing containing vanilla aroma, aspartam, etc...
    is it ok to take that during water fast ?

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09 Sep 2014 22:45 #23249 by TheFastDoctor
TheFastDoctor replied the topic: vomiting on the last fast why ?
These are indeed safe during a fast dear Pierrot.. note that the only organic molecule in there, macrogol, is not digestible and not absorbable so it would not trigger the taste buds like food. The inorganic salts would likewise not be interpreted as food. There's very little to choose between these two preparations which incidentally comes from the same manufacturer. I would of course have preferred this without the taste but sometimes we have to make do with what we have... We typically give it on the 3rd day of a long fast but really only for people with an evacuation problem.. definitely not routinely!

André

All my posts are "generic", based on my opinions and experiences only and are not intended to replace the advice of your own licensed medical practitioner.

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11 Sep 2014 20:08 - 11 Sep 2014 20:09 #23267 by pierrot
pierrot replied the topic: vomiting on the last fast why ?
Ok, I'm now fasting I went to the pharmacist and ordered macrogol+ ketones strips.

I just wanna ask you about the delved deeper theory, english is not my mother tongue as you can read of course :)
So I'm not sure to have understood yours lasts posts about my objection about your delve deeper theory.
Could you explain it again in others words trying to reformulate, I'm not sure to have understood it as well, seems weird for me to delve deeper toxins although I was weigher (in fat) than my first fast when it occured. I was something like 10 kilos fatter when I began to experiment bloating on my second fast than my first fast.
Or does this means that the body tries to unleash toxins from older stacks of fat meanwhile burning the recent fat first creating a kind of gap in stacks of fat ?

Like the drawing I do, on the first time fast ever you could see that fat and toxins stacks are the same (just an hypothesis) :

Attachment stacks1stfast.jpg not found




But in the second according to this drawing there is now a gap between both stacks (from the benefits of the first fast) and so it could explain the detox reaction on the second fast although I was not digging fat as deep as the first fast ?

Attachment stacks2ndfast.jpg not found





Tell me if I understood correctly or not.



Another question is, does fat contains toxins mandatory or is there "free toxins fat" too ?


Could you explain me the difference between visceral fat and subcutaneous fat, from a physiological and fasting point of view ?
Is it visceral fat you call "stable fat" ?
I'm experiencing from little years hair loss commonly known as androgenic alopecia or male pattern baldness, fasting must clear this problem and so I must have a regrowth with fasting and clearing my body from toxins or not ?
Attachments:

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11 Sep 2014 22:19 #23269 by TheFastDoctor
TheFastDoctor replied the topic: vomiting on the last fast why ?
Dear Pierrot, I think your graphics is beautiful and accurate. Thanks for that. And English is not my mother tongue also.. I was about 20 before I learned to read and write it..

There is stable fat all over, but indeed visceral fat is most stable... organs like your kidneys for example, depends on a residual volume of fat to protect it from physical damage.

I have found a reasonable amount of hair re-growth after fasting.. but you MUST do this elimination cycles and regular fasting to make it work. Toxins build up over time and it takes time to eliminate that.

André

All my posts are "generic", based on my opinions and experiences only and are not intended to replace the advice of your own licensed medical practitioner.

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11 Sep 2014 22:27 #23270 by pierrot
pierrot replied the topic: vomiting on the last fast why ?
By regrowth you mean regrowth on bald areas which could be deserted for years ?

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11 Sep 2014 23:04 #23271 by TheFastDoctor
TheFastDoctor replied the topic: vomiting on the last fast why ?
Difficult to define, dear Pierrot, this is a very individual thing. I have to personally examine a patient to answer this question...

André

All my posts are "generic", based on my opinions and experiences only and are not intended to replace the advice of your own licensed medical practitioner.

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12 Sep 2014 15:43 #23276 by pierrot
pierrot replied the topic: vomiting on the last fast why ?
Dear FastDoctor, I'm water fasting since only 24hrs and I'm already fall in ketosis mode in only 24hrs. (got it by ketone's strips)

Is this normal a good sign I tought it was after 3 or 4 days isn't ?
That is my 3rd fast, maybe my body got the habit to fast now and respond quickly to sugar deprivation ?

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12 Sep 2014 22:06 #23277 by TheFastDoctor
TheFastDoctor replied the topic: vomiting on the last fast why ?
This is indeed a good sign dear Pierrot. It indicates your body knows how to use fat..

André

All my posts are "generic", based on my opinions and experiences only and are not intended to replace the advice of your own licensed medical practitioner.

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12 Sep 2014 22:33 #23278 by pierrot
pierrot replied the topic: vomiting on the last fast why ?
Ok that's sounds great.
I'm currently experiencing headaches and some scalp itching but there're not so disturbing.
I'm gonna try tomorrow some cardiotraining and the 5 detox phases.

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15 Sep 2014 18:27 - 15 Sep 2014 18:28 #23289 by pierrot
pierrot replied the topic: vomiting on the last fast why ?
Dear FastDoctor, I'm on my 4th water fast an I have some blurps with acid reflux taste on my mouth and got my stomach a little bloated too.
it seems that I can't drink so much because of the bloating.


I took 1 liter of macrogol on day 2 and another liter on day 3. My intestine are making some noise since I took it and still.

I did 30 minutes of cardiocycling on day 2 and again today on day 4th with the 5 cycles of detox both days.

What's happening ?
I could I get rid of it ?

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15 Sep 2014 22:40 #23291 by TheFastDoctor
TheFastDoctor replied the topic: vomiting on the last fast why ?
Sometimes, dear Pierrot, parts of the gut becomes disoriented during a fast, then "travel" in the wrong direction. Then a single dose of a drug like Metoclopramide (10 milligrams) often serves to just "show it the way".


And many of us move to dry fasting once experienced and detoxed adequately.. so don't force water if you are not thirsty... but also don't withhold it if you are.

I don't recommend macrogol too often. Once a year is likely enough. It can, if overused, contribute to electrolyte disturbances.

André

All my posts are "generic", based on my opinions and experiences only and are not intended to replace the advice of your own licensed medical practitioner.

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17 Sep 2014 08:47 #23298 by pierrot
pierrot replied the topic: vomiting on the last fast why ?
Dear FastDoctor,

I'm on my 6th day water fast, bloating have reduced a lot.
But I wanna ask something about urine color.
My urine is quite dark and sometime I have a little pressure on my kidneys.
Why my urine is dark ?
If my urine is dark because of toxins released from fat, how could this be possible, because fat's toxins are liposoluble instead of urine are watersoluble ?

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17 Sep 2014 08:59 #23299 by TheFastDoctor
TheFastDoctor replied the topic: vomiting on the last fast why ?
Dark urine, dear Pierrot, is very common during a fast.

Although the BULK of toxins released are fat soluble and not passing through the kidneys, some water soluble toxins are mobilized and eliminated this way, and of course a bit of ketones that forms from fat re-mobilization is also leaving your body via the urine.

Also sometimes the urine is more concentrated, particularly if you fast dry, relatively dry or sweat a lot in the elimination cycles.

André

All my posts are "generic", based on my opinions and experiences only and are not intended to replace the advice of your own licensed medical practitioner.

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